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A. L.
(Unregistered)
12/14/11 02:15 PM
It is Still a Problem new Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Even after all this years I think this article is still current.
After reading all your reviews I think that there was a misunderstanding of what my intention was.
I wanted to show the difference between the two professions. There is not a single person that can claim to perform both tasks. I agree that it has to be a very strong collaboration among the people involved. But this does not mean to step in each other’s areas; again I will take doctors as an example. Exactly their method of collaboration has to apply in our field too!!!


fraggedwitless
(Stranger )
01/12/12 02:30 PM
Re: It is Still a Problem [re: A. L.]Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

 



" There is not a single person that can claim to perform both tasks."


Really?


My first degree was in mechanical engineering, after which I spent about 10 years working in various engineering roles in metal processing, cable manufacture, aerospace components, electronic packaging and food processing.


In my early 30s I left work to spend two years working for an MA on an industrial design course aimed at converting engineers into hybrids. Hard work it was, too.


Six or so years on from that I am working as a freelance designer AND engineer. Some of my work is filling in specific gaps in teams, some of it starts with a clean sheet of paper and a client brief. In this instance, concepts are mine, ergonomics / usability are defined by me and I get involved with field testing, visuals are mine, test rigs are mine, project management is mine, engineering is generally mine, development and testing is mine, production CAD is most definitely mine to the point where it goes to the fab shops.  Heck, I even dabble in electrical system work and PLC programming for rigs.


I'll admit my sketching can be ropey, tho it is sufficient to get ideas across, and that I do call in experts when I get out of my depth (electronic system design, complex analysis problems, CFD etc).


Sleep deprivation comes with the territory.


I am based in the UK.  There are a couple of schools producing talented designer / engineer types, some of whom are extremely (multi) talented.   Some of those that have been through the system have names that you might recognise and whose products or work you will have used or benefitted from.  I have been working for a bit with another independant who made the transition at a younger age than me and a fair proportion of his work has made it into the shops.


Beware sweeping statements.



 





Shaun ahern
(Unregistered)
01/25/12 07:37 PM
please take note new Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

Just to make a correction here. You have industrial designers and engineering designers.... But also product design engineers , this discipline is taught as ether;
a half and half degree (half ID half mechanical engineering) about four years study
or as a double degree, two degrees both ID and ME about five years study
As far as i understand this program is new 'in relative terms' to the industry. It has been created to fill the gap which is the topic of the article above. And to create team leaders with an education in both fields, to lead the research groups of both designers and engineers who are tasked with the creation of a new product.
This degree is offered at 'Swinburne' melbourne Australia and at 'Monash' same city

JOHN Efekodo
(Unregistered)
02/19/13 12:54 AM
Good and Clear Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

This is a very clear article. The author says it all and I'm quite clear as to the differences between DE and ID. I studied (Engineering Design) DE in the UK and we was put through the process of how to make products work. But for the life of me I never really understood why I was unable to make them beautiful or aethethic, that is until now. It's the ID's work to do that and not mine.

Hannu Havusto
(Unregistered)
09/17/13 12:16 AM
Come on - this is not true anymore new Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

I was looking for texts where industrial design and mechanical design (engineering) are compared. I was really surprised to find this article. I think there are many old fashioned, conservative and stubborn opinions that might have been true many years ago but not anymore.
1. Industrial design is not art. It is a function in product development that tries to find an optimum solution that fills users and manufacturers needs. It starts to researching all possible facts to make a description how and where and by whom the product is used AND what are the best ways to manufacture it.
2. It is a totally wrong idea that FIRST some engineer design a product and AFTER that there comes an artist (industrial designer) who tries to soften some sharp corners and add nice color to make it more acceptable for the buyer.
3. Regarding draft angles it takes about couple of minutes to explain the basic idea of them to industrial design student. And then he/she at least tries to make them right. Of course there are difficult forms and complex molds that is not so easy to understand. But that's why we need injection molding experts to give advice that everything will be ok for molding. But in many case a good industrial designer can also think better solutions for the whole product concept and then it might be possible to use cheaper natural molds and so on.
I hope that borders between engineers and industrial designers will be removed because we need all the best expertise to make good products.

not hybrind
(Unregistered)
10/15/13 11:34 AM
ID and DE are different new Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

The last review gives the impression that ID and DE are lately "Fused" to one. This is the dangerous position that many companies have adopted. By eliminating DE (not tooling engineer) you have created a hybrid creature that is half able of delivering a finished product.
ID is an industrial artist it is not a product designer. The contribute of the ID on the design process is anything but engineering. Therefore an ID with some engineering knowledge will only design a half finished design.
If the author of this article takes as example the draft angles I don't think he means just that. For a product to be designed properly is needed not just draft angles but many other particular features that only an engineer may address during the product design process.
This mindset is the cause of catastrophe of many organizations that the new product design is left on the hands of the hybrids like the last reviewer.

Dexter Francis
(Unregistered)
11/17/13 08:04 PM
Whence Product Design? new Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

It may be time to update this article, as many schools, such as Stanford, have been offering courses of study which attempt to bridge the gap between the art of Industrial and science of Engineering Design. Particularly in this day when CAD Drafter/Detailing is called "Design" and Engineering Analysis (Thermal/Structural) must blend with User Experience, it's not possible to settle for traditional Mechanical/Electrical/Software boundaries.

Isa L
(Unregistered)
11/25/13 06:01 AM
The Jack of all Trades new Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

I am curious what would the last reviewer (and anyone else that agree with him) think if the Stanford offers courses of study for brain and plastic surgeons combined.
People, nobody, nobody is "Jack of all Trades"!!!!
Universities want your money and they claim to train you in both this specialties but you know deep in your heart that your skills are limited in one direction only. Maybe there is a "Da Vinci" among us but we all know he/she is an exception.

Ivanhoe Chaput
(Unregistered)
03/14/15 07:37 PM
There is quite a difference...in my opinion. Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

As Agjah and others point out, it's not merely draft angles that may be missing. Without making a book out of his article, there are many aspects to designing plastic injection molded parts such as thinning out ribs, sharp corners where you don't want sink marks and radii where added strength is needed. There may be places that require ejector pins and maybe a boss needs to be added or adding a slide for a required snap. There are material issues such as using a high percentage of glass for strength that may require a change in shape for fill or flow. There are gating types such as fan gates, overlap gates and film gates that need to be positioned for both function and cosmetics. And on and on. I've been a design engineer all my career, but I also have an artistic flair. In my business of 34 years, I've used industrial design firms and have often had to re-shape features for one reason or another. A DE firm such as mine will sometimes hire an ID firm, but I've never seen it the other way around. I can only assume that when one doesn't know, one doesn't ask. Yes, I agree, it's a recipe for disaster.

Masumaido Sekuzu
(Unregistered)
12/08/15 09:38 PM
Sample Size Report this article as Inappropriate to us !!!Login to Reply

The notion that a person can excel in only one thing is narrow-minded. Sure, many people have specialties, but there exist people still who have more than one major skill or area of expertise.
It is understandable the frustration with those who claim to do more than they can deliver, but the way that emotion is conveyed should not be as to hold others back from their highest potentials by marking all as being in one single, limiting category or the other as this article does.
As to advice for the customer, request samples from the people with whom you would like to work, then make a decision based on the work those people have produced.


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